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Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 4:02 am
by Savra
Updated.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 5:05 am
by Savra
New flying kobalds.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 5:42 am
by Savra
Alright what is the decided techs? So I may make the images and remove any unneeded tech images.

Tech system hybrid between orcs and elves
(Benefits: I don't have to make any new images for these since I already have them, plus it leaves that scales tech image open for a scaledfolk version of troll skin but with a name change to Dragon scales.)

Evolutionary tech system that works as elves blacksmith tech works (E.g. Better weapons, armour, ranged.)
(Benefits: You end up with a lot more techs to have to research, plus elves would give a good base on what techs scaledfolks should get e.g. Brute strength which would be their counterpart to fencing tech.)

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:17 pm
by Alexander82
Kobolds are basic units. I don't think we should have flying kobolds

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 1:50 am
by Savra
It requires research first, I'm still going to work on image but it could require a certain tech before it like goblin grenade. It wouldn't be too op either since in flying form they are vulnerable to enemy archers and other ranged or flying units. Their attack would be low and essentially the only stats that remain the same are health, speed, and armour.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 1:51 am
by Savra
Btw, would kobald darter work as the races base archer or should we make it a special ranged unit and make another basic archer?

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:18 am
by Puss_in_Boots
I don't think the reworks were planned to have 9 techs and 3 different techs for every other subrace is all. I just don't like making techs out of everything, like how are non AoG lizards supposed to learn genetic modifications that will make their scales thicker? How would shamans make them deal more damage because of different categories of ascension, whatever that is?

This race needs to avoid techs to feel different from the other playstyles where you upgrade all blacksmith like techs just for a little extra firepower.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:21 am
by Puss_in_Boots
I favor using darts as base, archers just oversaturate the roster of ranged units.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 3:51 am
by Savra
As for ascension techs @Puss_in_Boots, ascension was just them being better warriors, no genetic modifications. Most of which was just ceremonial hence the shamans circle being the blacksmith as a double. They were more so blessed with whatever blessings would be bestowed upon them from whichever Dragon that was associated with war.

As for darter, that was the plan when I made it, we need more units that don't rely on bows for ranged anti infantry.

The kobalds wings tech was just kobalds getting stronger wings, they originally would have them but they would be no good because they aren't strong enough to enable them to fly, but after a while and some training they can get stronger wings which would enable flight for long periods of time over great distances.

Lizardmen technically already can regenerate but not to the degree of being able to regenerate any wounds, the ascension would simply be them honing that regenerative ability to a higher degree to were they can recover from those minor wounds.

Draconians would be similar to lizardmen in this way, but they also have the added ability to enchant their weapons with fire, and in some cases breath fire, through their draconic ancestry.

Snakemen simply are just honing the skills they already have.

Nagas would be doing the same as snakemen.

That being said, the ascension line is just simply a learning system for them, honing the skills they already possess to a more better degree to match the situation. The shamans at the shamans circle would be in charge of guiding them in honing their skills, with the help of their Dragon gods. That is how the ascension system works, no eveloutionary method needed.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:20 am
by Alexander82
It is not a matter of techs or being op.

I don't want flying kobolds

They are expected to be cheap units

Also in scalefolks there are no upgrades in the form of tech plus image change and in that case we would mechanically have an upgrade.

Let's keep wings on other more elite units.

We can even have an elute sub of winged reptiles but not the basic kobolds.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:21 am
by Alexander82
Btw I think that lizards should be the only regenerating sub

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:47 am
by Savra
Well, Draconian's are basically just hybrid lizardmen. They are lizardmen who have draconic ancestry that is so regeneration would make sense (that was why I made their upgrades coincide with lizardmens ones)

I didn't necessarily see a problem with it.

Btw, if not all kobalds should have flying form them at least we could let the witchdoctor keep its flying since when I made it I had in mind that it's spells list would be no bigger then that of a common priest for humans or a skeleton mages. And on top of that it's main purpose is healing anyway so it should be fine for at least that unit.

Also, we sticking with claws idea still? I could supply some images for that real quick.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:39 pm
by Alexander82
Wait, lizardmen are one race, draconians are another race (more related to dragons) so ni regeneration for them.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:42 pm
by Savra
Ok, so make claws techs?

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 3:12 pm
by Savra
What about stronger warriors at something.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 3:13 pm
by Savra
Also something for the healers so they don't have just generic old healing like most other races. Since they also can't use divine magic either I take it.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 9:25 pm
by Alexander82
lizard might give a regeneration spell (I had one in mind for troll shaman to enchant unit with troll regeneration. that could work for lizards too)

other units can have the normal healing too (like snakes and I think kobolds)

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 9:41 pm
by Savra
As for gorgon, it's a strict offensive caster, may some support spells but offensive spells are it's thing.I
Curse or petrify (if you can make it so that unit who is petrified can't be moved through then we can do this spell.)
Poison mist -same as in game
Hypnotic gaze - convert spell
Venom spike - magic missile effect that inflicts poison as well (could just give it magic missile or rotten instead)
Gorgons curse - negates 10% of units resistance but has 30% chance of working. Unaffected by resistance. Non-stackable. (This ones up for debates.)

Kobald witchdoctor was intended to be just healer in general with some minor support spells like disenchant and such.
Dragons blood -50-30% regeneration (your choice)
Draconic blessing - works like cleanse spell for elves
Transform into Flying form


Lizardmen I had in mind to give it abilities like:
Dragons might - same as one in game
Dragons scales - works similar to troll skin
And maybe a summon spell
Dragons blood - 50-30% regeneration (your choice)

The regeneration ability was just a scaledfolk version of 50% regeneration for orcs but would probably be weaker maybe.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 10:20 pm
by Alexander82
we won't have conversion anymore

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 11:38 pm
by Savra
Hmm, that explains the lich, ok so I will remove that part but can you pull off the the petrify suggestion?

Also how are those 3 tech images for the strength (attack) up for scaledfolks?

Currently we have for them these 3 that I think are pretty decent:
Leatherbacks
Image

Hardened scales
Image

Studded scales
Image

Precision marksmen
Image
Deadly marksmen
Image
Desc: Hunters hone their aim to deadly precision.

Dragons hunters
Image
Desc: Hunters that have been blessed for the hunt.


Mighty warriors
Image

Ghost warriors
Image
Desc: Warriors now are promised that their efforts will lead to their ascension to hunt forever alongside their Dragon gods. (A little twist to an actual thing that some tribes did.)

Dragon warriors
Image
Desc: Warriors now have the great dragons blessings, heightening their combat effectiveness.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 12:23 am
by Savra
Maybe I should use the eyes for ranged.
Image
Image
Image

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 2:04 am
by Savra
Updated.

Maybe this might be a better draconian lair. Nah, too glitchy looking.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 1:06 pm
by Puss_in_Boots
I think the eyes should be for sight.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 1:17 pm
by Alexander82
I guess that range techs should provide sight as well

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 1:20 pm
by Puss_in_Boots
Not exactly, it's just that better eyes don't necessarily mean better aim, it requires calculation and practice to improve effective range.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 1:25 pm
by Alexander82
yes but aiming well imply that you also can see hat you're aiming at.

Is it really necessary to make an additional tech just to make sure that an archer can see the target he can reach?

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 1:34 pm
by Puss_in_Boots
Hm, well I don't want archers to eventually get 8 range, so reducing the amount of range techs to 2 should be fine

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 1:38 pm
by Alexander82
I think that kobold archers will probably be stuck to range 7/8 but draconians, that are elite, should be able to hit at least 8 or 9

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 2:11 pm
by Puss_in_Boots
I was talking about lizard archers which I remembered had 5 specifically. Draconians can get higher base range since they're elite.

Re: Scalefolk rework

Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 2:18 pm
by Alexander82
All stats will be revised anyway.

Nothing in thia topic is still settled