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Greek Fire Siphon and Cheirosiphone (flamethrower)- ACCEPTED

Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 10:26 am
by TheBluePhoenix
It is basically similar to fire arrows shooting units .the only differences:
The burn effect is stronger
It works only on humans
To seperate it from poison arrows, it should like ballista have area damage without researching the tech
It should cost 4+
Wat say?

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 11:14 am
by ejm29
It sounds good, but the name should probably be changed, as "flamethrower" seems a little to modern in my opinion :)

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 12:30 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
What do u suggest? Fire breather?? :D :lol:

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 12:49 pm
by Alexander82
Is that am historical unit? Otherwise i would see it better for the fantasy version

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 3:40 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
Yes they are historic ones. Used in persian and indian armies. Filled fuel in their mouths and spat it through a torch which lit the fuel. I will try to find an image. Also there is nothing in this unit which is impractical or fantastical. It is realistic and fit for aos

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 4:22 pm
by COOLguy
Are the people doing the spitting? If so then I am against the idea: too fantasy and un-AoS.

But I am familiar with naphtha incendiary launchers used by Persians. (similar to Greek fire launchers and siphons)

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 5:07 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
I dont get you cool guy. How is this non aos? You can easily breath fire by spitting fuel in your mouth through a flame torch. Try googling it and you will find it. One of the images similar to what i am suggsting is:

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 5:41 pm
by COOLguy
I know people do it. It is common in circuses and other such entertainment for shock effect.

But it's impractical for use in the battlefield. The range is limited and rate of fire is awfully slow.

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 6:25 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
Yes but multiple nearby units can be burnt with it. And i dont think shooting an arrow takes less time than spitting fuel. If you want we can use flamethrowers which i checked were used everywhere(ships towers etc like light siege units or like small hand held weapons) if you are not much into the spitting one

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 8:45 pm
by ejm29
I also think that a "firebreather' is more suited to AOF. Although it is possible that they could be used in battle, they would be quite useless due to the range and the fact that they would have to carry flasks of alcohol/oils around the battle field (which I imagine would be pretty heavy and make them rather unbalanced)

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 4:42 am
by TheBluePhoenix
Check out the net there is nothing like that its just a light cylinder which they used to throw flame at farther distances. I did not suggest that at first as i thought that it was too modern . But i found that it was not so and was used widely. And its an infantry unit. So it ought to be killed by ranged units otherwise it would be op. I am not undersyanding why u ppl are calling it aof suited and not aos suited. These units/weapons were actually present in medevial times. Then why not include them in aos??

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 12:26 pm
by COOLguy
TheBluePhoenix wrote: If you want we can use flamethrowers which i checked were used everywhere(ships towers etc like light siege units or like small hand held weapons) if you are not much into the spitting one
Yes, please.

Bows in medieval times had a rate of fire anywhere from 12 arrows in 17 seconds to 9 in a minute, depending on draw strength with a much greater range. And fire breathing is slowed still more by the fact that fire breathers must at some point clear their mouths of the toxin to breathe air. :)
I don't think that it was necessarily that wide spread of a method: I see them more in games than in actual histories.

So it just seems more practicable to make them like you said above (like light siege units or hand held weapons)

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 12:31 pm
by Alexander82
Got an idea. Why don't we make a faquir unit that can trow fire as a special skill once in a few turn? For the normal attacks he will use the faquir horns

Being an ascetic we might train it at the church

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 3:58 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
This sounds more aof suited than my original idea. Better make it as cool guy agreed : a handheld weapon and a light siege unit .stats:

Weapon holding unit( please think of a name)
Cost 4
Health:11
Ranged unit or infantry cant decide but lets go by infantry
Power 10(armoured units have some protection while others dont have any)
Speed 3
Pierce armour , armour 0
Conversion resistance 0%
Vision/sight 5
Range: affects all units in 1 direction for 2 blocks.
All units having pierce armour less than 4 will get burnt (-6 hp per turn) for 3 turns if attacked by it

Siege unit (name for this too req)
Cost 6
Health 25
Movement 1
Range affects till 4 blocks in 1 dirn
Attack power 20( same conDn as before)
Sight 8
Conversion res 50%
Pierce armour 2
Effect of burning same just more effective (-7 hp) and works for any unit with any armour

Maybe a bit complex but i am sure we will figure out a way to maje them simple
Need some images and names for both too

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 4:24 pm
by COOLguy
Looks pretty good. We will have to find some really cool names. :)

I think the costs should maybe be 3 and 5, since (esp. the light siege) would be underpowered compared to the ballista.

How long does the burning last?

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 5:23 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
3 turns( i have specified it)
Ok i agree that but i thought that the burn was quite powerful. Especially with the area damage. Neverthe less if you think so i will change it

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:08 pm
by Alexander82
Faquir horns are historical weapons used by fquirs for self defense

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:36 pm
by COOLguy
Alexander82 wrote:Faquir horns are historical weapons used by fquirs for self defense
Different thread then :) (this one seems to have been changed) Aren't Fakirs like Dervishes?
TheBluePhoenix wrote:3 turns( i have specified it)
Ok i agree that but i thought that the burn was quite powerful. Especially with the area damage. Neverthe less if you think so i will change it
Okay if the burn is very powerful we can keep it the way it was, I guess I thought the burn was a little weak. :)

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:39 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
Actually the burn is -7 hp per turn so the unit dies in the next turn if it is a weak one archer pikeman swordsman and so on. Hence i thought it could be quite powerful. now we need 2 names and images and also dev's consent

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:56 pm
by COOLguy
Good point - that could be 4 units killed for the siege unit. So the old cost is good.

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 8:10 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
Ok then the stats remain as they were before.
Now can we have some names and images please??
Also dev pls give some suggestions(i assume he is moee than just busy as he is not replying to my emails as well) :shock: :roll:

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 8:44 pm
by COOLguy
Dev is very busy. Be nice to him. :)

Don't worry - that gives us plenty of time for image and names.

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 9:11 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
Yeah right
How about fire breather for infantry unit and pyroliser for siege?
(I know they sound complete shit but for a start they are fine....)

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sun Sep 20, 2015 7:52 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
Can anyone make some images for the two pls

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sun Sep 20, 2015 8:06 pm
by COOLguy
Please save the light siege for me: it might be a while but I can make it eventually. ++ we have plenty of time as this vote is already underway.

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Sun Sep 20, 2015 9:25 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
Ok didnt know that someone was working on it
Thanks cool guy 8-)

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:43 am
by TheBluePhoenix
Then alexande4 can you make the other image of infantry one?

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 1:44 pm
by COOLguy
Here are some names:

for the infantry one - cheirosiphones (literally hand-siphon)

the siege was harder to come up with:
- siege siphon
- megasiphon
- Median Fire Launcher

What do you think?

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 2:21 pm
by Alexander82
Can you give me a referal image? i don't know what it should looks like

Re: flamethrower

Posted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:50 pm
by ejm29
I found a few. Not sure how "realistic" they are Though :)