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Structure: Moat

Posted: Tue May 06, 2014 7:39 pm
by Stratego (dev)
I am about to create it but need few hint and help:

the plan was:
Structure: Moat:
- Building time is long, works as normal water, hard to destroy (300hp or so) and melee and siege can only damage it . You can sail on it.

First problem is the icon: see the attached version i made but seems ugly, does anyone have better idea/can create the 32x32 tile?
- the tile should fit to any terrain
- if 2 moats are built next to each other (from any direction!) than they should seem connected.
- is should look fairily good alone.

the second problem is: if there is a ship on it, what can you attack the ship or the moat? Or even questionable if the moat should be attackable or not...

third problem: should enemy sail onto my moat?

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 6:37 am
by Mairon
I would think of it like a bridge.
1) I can't help you with that one.
2) Ship. Moats should be attackable.
3) Yes, he should be able to, but it will look weird if the enemy cannot walk on your bridge but can sail on your moat, so make both either passable or impassable by the enemy (and by allies, it is really frustrating when your ally can't step on your bridge).
EDIT: Also 300 hp is too much. Think of a catapult or few behind moats...

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 6:50 am
by Stratego (dev)
I would think of it like a bridge.
exactly
so make both either passable or impassable
yes the "allies need passability" was already mentioned, and i plan to do that.
EDIT: Also 300 hp is too much.
what hp would you suggest?

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 11:06 am
by Mairon
175 hp maybe? Though ornithopters can fly above and destroy the catapult or other kinds of artillery behind it (and only if enemies will be enabled to fly/sail through/on them), it's still a lot more than normal walls and players may prefer to build this over normal walls. Maybe make workers deal 1 dmg (which can't do any harm anyways) and let them have a 5000% bonus on moats, so they will deal 51 damage to moats. Or maybe make it their ability to deconstruct enemy moats just like they construct/repair their buildings (map icon - hammer with a red cross on it?)

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2014 10:48 pm
by COOLguy
Hi!
I made this try at a tile. When it is by itself, it should look like it ends; when it is with others, it should appear as bridges.
I think should be sailable and also should be crossable by the player who builds it.
I tried with the 32x40 overlapping idea.
Please tell me what you think (or if you think it will work).
:)
Also there is a permutation of this idea here: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=531

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2014 7:24 pm
by ejm29
I dont think moats should be able to be attacked by all types of unit. Just workers (as they could fill it in) and catapult (the rocks they shoot could fill it in) :)

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2014 8:02 pm
by COOLguy
Good idea. Do the tiles look ok?

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2014 8:30 pm
by Stratego (dev)
sorry but i dont see the point of the overlapping images, i tried to puzzle with this but still i dont get it :)

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2014 8:50 pm
by ejm29
Its a very nice image cool guy. But if you repeated it over and over to make a long moat it may look a little strange. As it would be a long line of bridges over the moat Again and again. I love the bridge/end of moat effect though. :)

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 2:28 am
by COOLguy
The top bridge overlaps the bottom land. It might look not so good over and over again. Is there any idea that might be better?

Daniel: I can also make a version that doesn't overlap if that would help you see better. :)

Maybe if they were continuous straight bridges instead of curved repeating?

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 5:52 am
by Stratego (dev)
bridge: actually i dont understand the bridge concept: arent moats should be impassable by land units? only naval units?

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 2:23 pm
by COOLguy
Hmmm. **thinking**
Is it possible to overlap in two directions? Up and sideways?

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 6:37 pm
by Stratego (dev)
to the right maybe, i have never tried it, why? what is the idea?

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 12:45 am
by COOLguy
Here is what I mean: The two extra pieces are underlappers. It should work to look awesome. :)
I don't think I can try them on Tiled though.

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:19 am
by balint
I made a new version of your idea, because it is a very good idea.
I replaced a few green pixels with darker ones, so it won't get mixed (water and green woulld be next to each other)

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 4:36 pm
by COOLguy
Yes, but I think that the strips of grass should underlap. So the grass is covered by the water when they are next to each other. But I see what you mean. I don't know even if we can do two simultaneous lappers. Daniel hasn't said yet. :)

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 6:37 pm
by ejm29
This may be a bad idea, but why don't we just modify the image Daniel did? Make it square. And Make it blocked insted of fuzzy. In short, a blue tile. The same as the middle of the in-game lake it may not by fancy , but it would look like water.

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2014 7:09 pm
by COOLguy
Is this what you would like, ejm29?

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2014 7:38 pm
by ejm29
Exactly! I know it may seem like a bad idea. But a moat is essentialy a ditch full of water. :) just a thought :D

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2014 11:42 pm
by COOLguy
It has merit. This image will appear to have sandbars when it together. It will be much easier to implement though..

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2014 8:56 am
by ejm29
Ah ok. I see that now. Nicly done.

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2014 1:37 pm
by COOLguy
Thank you!

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Mon Nov 24, 2014 2:40 pm
by balint
nice!

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Mon Nov 24, 2014 3:53 pm
by COOLguy
Thank you! :)

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Tue May 05, 2015 7:38 pm
by balint
What about making this unit like the new wall?

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Tue May 05, 2015 8:43 pm
by ollie444
So it combines with moat's next to it? Yes yes yes. :D

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Tue May 05, 2015 8:46 pm
by ollie444
Also watch out for half water tiles, where the top bit is water...

Moat

Posted: Sat Apr 02, 2016 6:18 am
by TheBluePhoenix
Historically, the casles and all structures,walls had a thin water body dug nearby to protect them from infantry attacks. So i feel, given the usability and power of man at arms against them, it will be a good option. If this is implemented though; we will need another structure called drawbridge.
The moat will be the same as the river tile. The only thing will be that workers will be able to make them just nearby any structure in about 4 turns per tile.
It was filled with crocs too so that any man once fallen lands in their stomachs and nowhere else
What do u think?

Re: Moat

Posted: Sat Apr 02, 2016 10:22 am
by patroid

Re: Structure: Moat

Posted: Sat Apr 02, 2016 1:27 pm
by Stratego (dev)
merged..