Auxiliaries

Put here any ideas, suggestions about unit or structure properties.

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DoomCarrot
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Auxiliaries

Post by DoomCarrot » Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:32 pm

Well, the auxiliaries in the game are not produced randomly, which unbalances them from my testing. The original concept was you would get one of 4 random but powerful units for the turn cost, which would help balance their usefullness.

However, being able to just produce them individually causes a few issues for each unit, mainly:

Skirmishers: A bit too powerful, and discourage production of master skirmisher tech.
Horseman: (I don't think knihts existed in Roman times :) ) These guys are also a bit too powerful to just produce on the spot, especially with bonuses from garrisons and centurions.
Swordsman: Basically same problem as horseman
Archers: They were designed to be literally identical to saggitarus, so they really don't serve any purpose on their own besides looks lol. :lol:

So, I think auxiliaries really need to be created randomly from a single thing, or else we need to kind of rebalance all of the units (mostly nerfs, besides the archer).
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by COOLguy » Sun Feb 19, 2017 10:56 pm

This was a decision made by Daniel and myself - if there are enough people who can convince us that the random wouldn't ruin strategy (and also have people regularly use them) maybe we can change it sometime.
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by DoomCarrot » Mon Feb 20, 2017 3:40 pm

Well, the random creates strategy....

They are powerful units for their cost, but you might not get what you want really. So they could be practical to raise a big army of them, but making one or two if you are getting attacked will probably not help you at all unless you get lucky. Otherwise they are kind of just reskinned overpowered versions of other units.

However, if nothing changes, at least please change the "knight auxiliary" name. :lol: There were no knights back then, I just double checked.
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by Alexander82 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 4:39 pm

I agree with Doom. Randomizing those units will add strategy to the game because you can choose between deciding what you prefer to produce or pending a reduced amount of turn without deciding what you will obtain. Also they benefit from specific buffs for roman units so without randomizing recruitment they are overall better than many normal units that doesn't.
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by jboer2 » Sun Feb 26, 2017 11:00 pm

The romans had Cataphract but I'd expect them to be similar in strength to knights since they were also fully armoured! Probably not good for the Auxiliary Knights replacement name.
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by Hardeep » Mon Feb 27, 2017 4:32 am

Cataphracts were different from auxiliary horse, but Cataphracts might be cool too! :D
Just call Auxiliary horse Auxiliary horse :)
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by DoomCarrot » Tue Feb 28, 2017 5:11 pm

Auxiliary "Horseman," unless you want the horse to be riderless. :lol:
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by Hardeep » Tue Feb 28, 2017 5:26 pm

It's implied with the 'Auxiliary' in front of it and it sounds much cooler and Latinyer
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by DoomCarrot » Wed Mar 01, 2017 3:46 am

Well then we might as well call it "Axilia Equus" :lol:
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by Alexander82 » Sat Mar 04, 2017 8:19 pm

DoomCarrot wrote:Well then we might as well call it "Axilia Equus" :lol:
equites
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by Alpha » Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:05 pm

I already made a topic on Equites ;-;
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by Alexander82 » Tue Mar 07, 2017 10:19 pm

this would be an auxiliari equites, a different unit
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by DoomCarrot » Sat Nov 11, 2017 12:34 am

Auxiliary works as it should now, but I find it weird that you must build an "auxiliary swordsman"

I think auxiliary would be better, as swordsman is too specific, and coupled with the image, might make some players think it is a glitch when they build an auxiliary swordsman but get an archer instead
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by LordOfAles » Sat Nov 11, 2017 7:26 am

Agreed, but i saw in files we have this; which i cant find ingame
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by COOLguy » Sat Nov 11, 2017 2:22 pm

LordOfAles wrote:Agreed, but i saw in files we have this; which i cant find ingame
Yes this should be in the game
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by DoomCarrot » Sat Nov 11, 2017 3:32 pm

Also, auxiliary horseman is still called auxiliary knight. Not sure if that is an easy fix or not, but knights did not exist during the time period of the roman empire :lol:
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by DoomCarrot » Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:24 pm

Been playtesting these guys and I have come to the conclusion that they are pretty OP. I think nerfing all attack by 1-2 would not be unreasonable. I underestimated just how powerful they can be with centurion and drummer buffs
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by makazuwr32 » Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:41 pm

But it is really easy to kill drum beater and centurion is also cost.
So i don't think that they need some nerfs.

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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by COOLguy » Wed Dec 27, 2017 3:51 pm

DoomCarrot wrote:Been playtesting these guys and I have come to the conclusion that they are pretty OP. I think nerfing all attack by 1-2 would not be unreasonable. I underestimated just how powerful they can be with centurion and drummer buffs
Funny story, I have yet to have anyone play them against me :) I think that the randomness makes it balanced because people would have to go all Roman to make sure that the auxiliaries worked
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by DoomCarrot » Wed Dec 27, 2017 7:14 pm

Yes, I am playing a game against mak right now, and I went with a largely roman strategy, which has worked wonderfully so far. The one problem is ballistae. Ballistae are devastating if you do not have some way to take them out.

Generally you have to play such a strategy slowly, because you need time to build a balanced auxiliary army. It can be very powerful, but I could see someunfortunate circumstances where you just get three Auxiliary horsemen in a row against an opponent who goes full infantry/pikemen lol
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by makazuwr32 » Wed Dec 27, 2017 8:20 pm

I already have 2 catapults and i'll build even more.
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by DoomCarrot » Wed Dec 27, 2017 10:10 pm

Looks like those catpults didn't work out that well though :P
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by Stratego (dev) » Sat Apr 07, 2018 6:18 pm

sorry, was it intentional to have auxiliaries trained in 1 turn ?
- or i just left it there accidentally on 1 turn cost?
- if the latter than how muh was the cost - 2 turns?

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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by godOfKings » Sun Apr 08, 2018 12:23 pm

I believe 3 turns
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by COOLguy » Fri Apr 13, 2018 3:39 pm

godOfKings wrote:I believe 3 turns
Correct
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by godOfKings » Sat May 19, 2018 10:43 am

i think stats of auxiliary actually need to b nerfed

first of all auxiliary knight deals same damage as spahi, has more hp and p armor than spahi, and with bonuses from centurions and drummers they can b more effective than a 5 turn polish hussar with their high hp, high armor, and high damage
(25 DAMAGE!!! srsly?)

my stat suggestion,

hp-20
armour -2/1
but DEFINITELY BONUS- 75 % ( 14 dmg- 18 dmg next to centurion)

next to a centurion it will have 4 armor and 3 p armor so it will b able to survive 1 hit of pikeman,

then auxiliary swrodsman
it is similar to a 4 turn roman legionary,
but has deals more damage due to higher bonus and higher atk (11)

i m not sure how much the stats should b nerfed actually
may b atk can b 10 dealing 18 damage total and not killing units that it doesnt have bonus against with 1 hit (like pikeman and archer)

also archers should have bonus against auxiliary swordsman as they r not heavily armored

and i would like to remind that auxiliary archers still dont get bonus damage from skirmishers
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by makazuwr32 » Sat May 19, 2018 10:58 am

My suggestion of fixes:
1. Auxillary horseman: lower bonuses from 150% to 50% (normal knight's one). Their stats are otherwise fine.
2. Auxillary swordman: remove current bonuses at all, give them base swordman bonuses. (This one is the only unit from all 4 who can get both bonuses from centurion and get +2 to damage and armors)
3. Auxillary archer - make vurable to skirmishers, lower armor to 1/1, lower hp to 17. (right now they are the most tanky foot archers in the game! especially due to the fact that they have 1/2 armor, this will courage players to use saggitarius archers)
4. Auxillary skirmisher - lower armors to 0/5. They will still be more powerful than master skirmishers but with just a bit more hp, same armor and a bit higher damage.
Also fix bug where all cavalry deals to auxillary foot units only its base damage and no bonus damage while it must.

Also to courage players use legionaries i suggest to increase legionaries damage to 12.

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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by COOLguy » Sat May 19, 2018 1:09 pm

I think those are pretty good edit suggestions.
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by godOfKings » Sat May 19, 2018 6:35 pm

I could try to fix them
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Re: Auxiliaries

Post by godOfKings » Mon May 21, 2018 8:34 am

coolguy i made these according to makazuwr's suggestion, wat do u think?
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unit_roman_aux_skirmisher.json
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unit_roman_aux_knight.json
(4.02 KiB) Downloaded 14 times
unit_roman_aux_archer.json
(3.67 KiB) Downloaded 18 times
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For I watch over this world looking for those worthy to become kings, and on the way get rid of the fakes and rule over the fools

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