Elephant Balista

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Joddy El Campeador
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Elephant Balista

Post by Joddy El Campeador » Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:53 am

Balista loaded to the elephant back
Stats like balista and HP&speed like the elephant

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makazuwr32
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by makazuwr32 » Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:58 am

uhm. just no.
also please no multipost.

Remember we don't need fantastic units. for that you can go to AoF.
Here we need historical units only.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

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samuelch
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by samuelch » Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:46 pm

Khmer used ballista on elephants.
"In the Southeast Asia, the powerful Khmer Empire had come to regional dominance by the 9th century AD, drawing heavily on the use of war elephants. Uniquely, the Khmer military deployed double cross-bows on the top of their elephants."
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makazuwr32
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by makazuwr32 » Tue Apr 24, 2018 1:39 pm

I will look for more scources if this is real one.
Thanks for idea of period.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

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godOfKings
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by godOfKings » Fri Apr 27, 2018 4:15 pm

Could b an upgrade of elephant archer?
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makazuwr32
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by makazuwr32 » Fri Apr 27, 2018 7:18 pm

I looked for my scources and i must say that it was their never realised concept.
And even more why it is not historically accurate because ballista was designed in Late Rome time (4th century) when Khmers empire was dead i think for at least a 5 centuries.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

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samuelch
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by samuelch » Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:34 am

It's not a balista. It's just similar to balista. Civilization games have Khmer with Elephant balista as unique units.
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makazuwr32
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by makazuwr32 » Sat Apr 28, 2018 4:42 am

Then it must have due to flaws only one action/turn.
And better name.
I agree about upgrade of elephant archer.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

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godOfKings
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by godOfKings » Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:39 am

Here is my idea, it is upgrade of elephant Archer, it has 2 actions since its 'repeating crossbow', 6 atk, no area damage, 5 range, HP and armour shall b same as basic elephant Archer

Upgrade cost is 6 turns
For six turns u get 1+ atk 1+ action, no extra spell resist, speed or hp

Wat will b name? Khmer elephant crossbowman ? Or Khmer elephant ballista? Or simply elephant ballista or elephant crossbowman?

Description: The Khmer empire used a unique strategy combining war elephants with repeating crossbows to destroy their enemies from above
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godOfKings
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by godOfKings » Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:44 am

altalt throwers, auxiliary skirmishers and voulgirs should get high bonus against elephant archers, and voulgirs should also get high bonus against elephants in general
There is no place for false kings here, only those who proves themselves to b the true kings of legend, or serves under me

For I watch over this world looking for those worthy to become kings, and on the way get rid of the fakes and rule over the fools

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makazuwr32
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by makazuwr32 » Sat Apr 28, 2018 12:39 pm

Gok Variant is fine.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

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godOfKings
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by godOfKings » Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:13 am

in case stratego decides this to b upgrade of elephant archer, here is final stat suggestion.

Khmer elephant ballista
(upgrades from elephant archer)

Description: The Khmer empire used a unique strategy combining war elephants with repeating crossbows to destroy their enemies from above

cost of upgrade tech: 6 turns
hp: 120
atk: 6
armor: 1
p.armor:2
speed: 2
range: 5
action: 2
spell resist: 0
gets basic blacksmith upgrades same as elephant archer
summary:
godOfKings wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:39 am
Here is my idea, it is upgrade of elephant Archer, it has 2 actions since its 'repeating crossbow', 6 atk, no area damage, 5 range, HP and armour shall b same as basic elephant Archer

Upgrade cost is 6 turns
For six turns u get 1+ atk 1+ action, no extra spell resist, speed or hp
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elephant ballista.png
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Last edited by godOfKings on Sat Nov 03, 2018 7:24 pm, edited 3 times in total.
There is no place for false kings here, only those who proves themselves to b the true kings of legend, or serves under me

For I watch over this world looking for those worthy to become kings, and on the way get rid of the fakes and rule over the fools

Stratego (dev)
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by Stratego (dev) » Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:41 am

current heavy elephant image
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godOfKings
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by godOfKings » Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:20 pm

Updated previous post with latest image
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For I watch over this world looking for those worthy to become kings, and on the way get rid of the fakes and rule over the fools

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Morningwarrior
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by Morningwarrior » Tue Sep 17, 2019 7:14 am

This is very crazy,but is be a good and op unit.
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Morningwarrior
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by Morningwarrior » Tue Sep 17, 2019 7:17 am

Ok,ok I really thought it was literally an elephant-borne ballista not a crossbow guy
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godOfKings
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by godOfKings » Sun Nov 03, 2019 5:07 pm

Could b a 7 turn stand alone ballista unit with lower damage and range than ballista

HP 120
Armor 1/1
Range 5
Atk 8
Action 2
Power range 1
Power penalty 50%
Pierce damage
Speed 2
Made in siege workshop not archery range
Can b upgraded by heavy ballista tech to have

130 HP
Armor 2/2
Range 5
Atk 10
There is no place for false kings here, only those who proves themselves to b the true kings of legend, or serves under me

For I watch over this world looking for those worthy to become kings, and on the way get rid of the fakes and rule over the fools

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Endru1241
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by Endru1241 » Sun Nov 03, 2019 7:37 pm

Unfortunately Elephant Ballista is a problem in few ways.

Classification:
If it would be treated as siege engine, then it makes it burnable, which doesn't make sense.
If it would be classified close to Elephant Archer then it would have too little weaknesses.

Building training it:
Archery range training unit with splash damage maybe too much.
Siege workshop training alive unit that depends on hp doesn't fit.

Historical correctness:
There is no evidence, that anywhere in the entire world anyone used ballista on elephants.
Khmer empire mounted chinese-like double bed crossbows, but it could be only for transport.
Even if it was used from the back of elephant - it would require sizing down the weapon - thus more similar to crossbow on steroids than real ballista.
Nonetheless it should be named Elephant Siege Crossbow or something like that.

Pure balance:
Even with only 8 power it deals 16 damage on hit and 8 to every adjacent unit on range!
As it completely outclasses elephant archer it should also cost significantly more - 8-9 turns.

Lastly - it would definitely need it's own upgrade - why would ballista upgrade increase hp of leaving mounted unit?

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godOfKings
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by godOfKings » Mon Nov 04, 2019 4:18 am

godOfKings wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:13 am
Khmer elephant ballista

Description: The Khmer empire used a unique strategy combining war elephants with repeating crossbows to destroy their enemies from above

cost: 7 turns
hp: 120
atk: 6
armor: 1
p.armor:2
speed: 2
range: 5
action: 2
spell resist: 0
gets basic blacksmith upgrades same as elephant archer
that was simply a suggestion in case players wants to go the ballista route, and the stats can b changed to better balance it with game, and i already gave a crossbow suggestion above too in case the final decision is go with crossbow (plus crossbow version has ready image so can b implemented right now)

made some changes, not an upgrade and cost 7 turns
There is no place for false kings here, only those who proves themselves to b the true kings of legend, or serves under me

For I watch over this world looking for those worthy to become kings, and on the way get rid of the fakes and rule over the fools

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Lynx Shafir
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by Lynx Shafir » Mon Nov 04, 2019 8:54 pm

TBH I Don't quite like this idea
Aside from the points mentioned above, don't we have enough elephant already?
I know it's typical and all but, hey...

I would support though any foot Indian units what had quite unique weapons too, wide era range to chose. Before more elepans...

Also WB GOK :)
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What your scars tell about you?

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godOfKings
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Re: Elephant Balista

Post by godOfKings » Tue Nov 05, 2019 10:04 am

Its your choice, the game only progresses by the majority vote after all, its not a necessity
There is no place for false kings here, only those who proves themselves to b the true kings of legend, or serves under me

For I watch over this world looking for those worthy to become kings, and on the way get rid of the fakes and rule over the fools

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