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trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2016 5:50 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
It has almost no bonus for catapult and canon ships
I feel it should

Re: trebuchet bonus

Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2016 8:51 pm
by Hardeep
It does have a big bonus for catapult ships, almost destroys in one hit, and cannons are not effected on land (by the trebuchet) so why should it at sea?

Re: trebuchet bonus

Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2016 11:39 pm
by DoomCarrot
Because its a boat... A rock smashing the side of a hull would sink it, no matter what type of boat it is.

I deffinately agree, its the stupidest thing to hurl 3 rocks at a cannon ship and not destroy it. :roll: +1

Also, mending ships don't seem to be affected that much by trebs either. They should be one hit kills imo, boulder vs fishing boat with tools, who wins?

Re: trebuchet bonus

Posted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 2:54 am
by COOLguy
DoomCarrot wrote:Because its a boat... A rock smashing the side of a hull would sink it, no matter what type of boat it is.
Boats would be an extremely difficult target.

Re: trebuchet bonus

Posted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 4:23 am
by DoomCarrot
Exactly, then they should have a less likely chance to hit, but insane damage when they do.

Re: trebuchet bonus

Posted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 5:03 am
by TheBluePhoenix
No but canon ships and catapults are slow and also their counterparts canoN towers and catapults have huge bonus(i understand they are easier to hit, but there should be at least some bonus against them)
And as for speed, bonus does not depend on speed, accuracy does and the treb is already inaccurate for them. I strongly suggest a 200-300 % bonus for them
(Btw cg, i just destroyed one of yr canon ships with an assassin because even the spartan could Not damage it more than 10)

Re: trebuchet bonus

Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 12:51 am
by DoomCarrot
Lol, you made a good although unrelated point. Some of the old units (spartans, elephants) are not at allvupdated to the newer units. I think all the old units have to have their bonuses double checked, because things like that make old units obsolete.

Re: trebuchet bonus

Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 11:00 am
by TheBluePhoenix
Dev please implement this also. It becomes very difficult to kill cannoneers and ships

Re: trebuchet bonus

Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 12:45 pm
by Stratego (dev)
Please specify what change to do?

Re: trebuchet bonus

Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 1:21 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
Increase the bonus of trebuchets for cannon ships to 250% and for canon ship 150%. Also for catapult ship it should be 200% not 150% As it is presently.
Logical reason- fast and heavy rocks hurled at ships may miss, but when they hit, they should be deadly destructive for the ship

Re: trebuchet bonus

Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 3:16 pm
by Stratego (dev)
No, trebushet should be accurate and bonused against structures or very slow units only.

Cannon ship can be easily killed by fire archers and cannoneers and irnithopters and quadriremes.

Cannoner is killable by almost anything even archers

I suggest figuring out some new units against them do not change the purpose of trebuchets.

Re: trebuchet bonus

Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 3:34 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
Well the very slow unit in ship are canon ships and catapult ships....

Re: trebuchet bonus

Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 3:55 pm
by Darkknight
TheBluePhoenix wrote:Well the very slow unit in ship are canon ships and catapult ships....
I fear that if they give trebuchets too much bonuses they will become very powerful. They are already one of the most used units in the game. People will just rely on trebuchets and it could ruin the balance of the game and possibly lower the use of other simpler units (fire archers) that are effective against the cannon ships because people will rather use trebuchets than other units because it will be strong against most unit (Easily destroy buildings/machines, decent against infantry)

Re: trebuchet bonus

Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 10:41 pm
by COOLguy
Daniel (the dev) wrote:No, trebushet should be accurate and bonused against structures or very slow units only.

Cannon ship can be easily killed by fire archers and cannoneers and irnithopters and quadriremes.

Cannoner is killable by almost anything even archers

I suggest figuring out some new units against them do not change the purpose of trebuchets.
Completely what I was going to say too. :)

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 4:15 am
by TheBluePhoenix
But then the melee units also are weak For the canon( spartan dOes only 10 damage to it). Can we not just reduce the bonus of the canon against trebs?

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 6:55 am
by Hardeep
Why? Treb has 10 range, must we make it even more unbalanced than it already is? It gets the job done, and it should have a weakness, if a cannon ball hits something like that, its pretty much done for.

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 7:01 am
by Stratego (dev)
we can give bonus to some of the std. units against cannoneer, but not trebuchet. that is for structures practically nothing else.

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 7:30 am
by TheBluePhoenix
Hardeep wrote:Why? Treb has 10 range, must we make it even more unbalanced than it already is? It gets the job done, and it should have a weakness, if a cannon ball hits something like that, its pretty much done for.
Similarly if a heavy rock hits the ship/canoneer, it is also pretty much done for
@dev ok then maybe we can form a new unit to counter canons, like a slingshot catapult having a large range?is that possible?

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 7:32 am
by TheBluePhoenix
The problem presently with cannons is that if you hit it with a treb, it loses some health but it moves closer to the treb and destroys it in a single shot.

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 7:50 am
by Hardeep
Why would anyone make cannons if they could make trebs? The only reason cannons are used is to counter trebs, I wouldn't make cannons if they weren't the only thing that could stop Trebuchets. They both have the same turn cost but trebs are only made in castles. Nobody makes a cannon if they can make a catapult, and nobody makes a catapult if the other guy has trebuchets. It is a sacred balance in the fabric of existence. So just dont attack cannons with trebuchets

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 12:00 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
Well i dont care much about your strategy but I will make cannons because they are best to gaurd a territory. Obviously not in castles but in siege factories. Also, workers can build them too

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 1:35 pm
by COOLguy
No, workers can't build cannons.

I use cannons a lot, because people seem to have a hard time countering them. But really it is simple (I am having no problem against DoomCarrot's cannons).

There are a lot of units to use against cannons, mounted and archers are the simplest. You can use other siege (mostly catapults and other cannons), or ornithopters. Infantry is generally too slow, but even then it is possible to kill cannons with them. The hardest part is if someone is protecting their cannons. Then you destroy the protection (ie Castle or screening cavalry) to destroy the cannon, as I did this last turn of our game. I destroyed a few of your heavy knights and then struck Doom's cannon with an ornithopter.

If you have cannons, the main thing is to protect them. When attacking with cannons, you can no longer protect them adequately, so another strategy to fight cannons is to wait until they expose themselves in an offensive.

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 1:43 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
Workers can built canon ships. Also , if backed up by mend ships,which are super easy to build with workers(it will be brought to notice in another thread)
They become very much invincible. though like any unit, they are not impossible to destroy, a lot of manpower is lost in destroying them

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 2:02 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
Anyways, seeing none of u were inclined to change anything(but i ask 1 more thing- how come canons are 100% accurate?) , i devised some new ways to counter them and soon cg u wont have any left :twisted: :D

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 2:10 pm
by DoomCarrot
TheBluePhoenix wrote:Workers can built canon ships. Also , if backed up by mend ships,which are super easy to build with workers(it will be brought to notice in another thread)
They become very much invincible. though like any unit, they are not impossible to destroy, a lot of manpower is lost in destroying them

I've been watching this unfold mostly, but this I 100% agree with. The mend/catapult ship spam strategy made popular by Hardeep (it is a good strategy) has pretty much ruined water maps for me lol :lol:

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 2:14 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
Forget it doom, nothings gonna change.I tried my best :( . So i devised a new strategy and it will work hopefully :D

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 4:48 pm
by COOLguy
The problem is not the trebuchet or cannons/ships like I said It is because of the spamming of workers and other menders (which I wholeheartedly engaged in and promoted)

But it should be limited to prevent annoying things like what Hardeep has done ever since the mend ship came out

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 4:52 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
COOLguy wrote:
But it should be limited to prevent annoying things like what Hardeep has done ever since the mend ship came out
Lol :lol:

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 4:55 pm
by COOLguy
TheBluePhoenix wrote:Anyways, seeing none of u were inclined to change anything(but i ask 1 more thing- how come canons are 100% accurate?) , i devised some new ways to counter them and soon cg u wont have any left :twisted: :D
lol let's see it. If you have finally stumbled upon a strategy that doesn't involve relying on greater production, I applaud you. I will then carry out my destruction of the DCPR by other means :)

Re: trebuchet bonus - ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 4:59 pm
by TheBluePhoenix
Dont worry, overproducing is hardeeps strategy, not mine :lol: . Anyways it will take some time .
Also what about cannons being 100% accurate? Thats weird given the inaccuracy of others